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Mansonmark New Mark

Joined: 09 Jul 2008 Posts: 131
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Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 8:44 am Post subject: |
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I see, so if you don't believe in the easter bunny that's your "doctrine"? Sorry, it doesn't work that way. As I've clearly stated, lack of belief is not a doctrine. Look, if I tell you that I can fly, yet offer no proof, do you have to prove I can't to not believe what I tell you? Of course not. If I claim something extraordinary I must provide the proof to back it up. Just because some people say god exists doesn't mean I need to have proof he doesn't to not believe. The lack of any evidence of god's existence is all the proof required not to believe. It must give you some personal comfort to think that Atheists are the same and "believe in something", but that's simply not the case. If god showed up tomorrow and said "Yo bitch, what up?" I would not continue to say he didn't exist. Neither would I have to "believe" in his existence, since proof was offered it would be a fact, requiring no "faith". _________________ www.evalbum.com
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Bradleycsocal New Mark
Joined: 04 Dec 2008 Posts: 1186
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Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 9:19 am Post subject: |
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You continue to defend your belief (like a Christian or Muslim or Jew etc). An Atheist derives their feeling of superiority from the belief that they "know" the truth therefore are enlightened in the same manner that a Christian does. Regardless of what you believe at the end of the day a Christian cannot prove God exists and an Atheist cannot prove that God does not.
That my friend is a fact........ |
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Mansonmark New Mark

Joined: 09 Jul 2008 Posts: 131
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Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 9:44 am Post subject: |
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The only fact is that you are dense and obviously have no concept of logic. I've spelled it out clearly enough that a third grader should get it. I'm a non-believer, get it? I should know better than to argue with a "believer". _________________ www.evalbum.com
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Bradleycsocal New Mark
Joined: 04 Dec 2008 Posts: 1186
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Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 9:35 pm Post subject: |
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I am not defending Christianity it is your assumption that I am a believer. Logic??? Your argument lacks logic; I don't have to prove my non belief to make it true??? Without proof it is only your opinion. You say a Christian can't prove God exists and you can't prove he doesn't. Some things can be proven as absolutes the existance or lack there of of God cannot be. At the end of the day everyone is left with their belief. This may help you understand;
See web results for belief
See images of belief
–noun
1. something believed; an opinion or conviction: a belief that the earth is flat.
2. confidence in the truth or existence of something not immediately susceptible to rigorous proof: a statement unworthy of belief.
3. confidence; faith; trust: a child's belief in his parents. |
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Mansonmark New Mark

Joined: 09 Jul 2008 Posts: 131
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Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 10:02 pm Post subject: |
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Are you kidding? Why don't you read the definitions you provided. They clearly show that my lack of belief is obviously not a belief. You are obviously a "believer" and can't comprehend the idea of not believing. That's your shortcoming, not mine. Since you enjoy online definitions:
Nonbeliever:
One who does not believe or have faith, as in God or a philosophy.
The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition copyright ©2000 by Houghton Mifflin Company. Updated in 2009. Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved.
Nonbeliever:
a person who does not believe, esp in God and religion
Collins English Dictionary – Complete and Unabridged 6th Edition 2003. © William Collins Sons & Co. Ltd 1979, 1986 © HarperCollins Publishers 1991, 1994, 1998, 2000, 2003 _________________ www.evalbum.com
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praxthym New Mark

Joined: 10 Oct 2009 Posts: 51
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Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 10:58 pm Post subject: |
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I was a run-of-the-mill stone-cold atheist for years until I came across a particular blog post. Let me share with you what convinced me to endorse theological logicism.
| Austro-Athenian Empire wrote: |
Is there any sense in which even the atheist is committed to recognising the existence of some sort of supreme, eternal, non-material reality that transcends and underlies everything else? Yes, there is: namely, the logical structure of reality itself.
Thus so long as the theist means no more than this by “God,” the theist and the atheist don’t really disagree. |
Here is a link to the entire article: Atheism and Theism Reconciled
I always refer to this article and rely on it when talking about god. It just tickles me pink to know that I have a logical theistic belief.
I also lean on this article (which is essentially the previous article's sequel): The Unspeakable Logos
This is also a good resource. |
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Bradleycsocal New Mark
Joined: 04 Dec 2008 Posts: 1186
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Posted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 8:54 am Post subject: |
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| Mansonmark wrote: |
Are you kidding? Why don't you read the definitions you provided. They clearly show that my lack of belief is obviously not a belief. You are obviously a "believer" and can't comprehend the idea of not believing. That's your shortcoming, not mine. Since you enjoy online definitions:
Nonbeliever:
One who does not believe or have faith, as in God or a philosophy.
The American Heritage� Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition copyright �2000 by Houghton Mifflin Company. Updated in 2009. Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved.
Nonbeliever:
a person who does not believe, esp in God and religion
Collins English Dictionary � Complete and Unabridged 6th Edition 2003. � William Collins Sons & Co. Ltd 1979, 1986 � HarperCollins Publishers 1991, 1994, 1998, 2000, 2003 |
God Bless....... |
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Mansonmark New Mark

Joined: 09 Jul 2008 Posts: 131
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ApolloTe New Mark

Joined: 01 Jul 2008 Posts: 356 Location: Jacksonville
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Posted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 8:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Mansonmark wrote: |
Imaginary Magic father figure in the sky bless to you as well....  |
Come on Manson mark , why not believe in god?
He Grants all our wishes , oops never mind
He doesnt let innocent ppl or children get hurt, ah shit stepped on my own toes again
and if I asked him to do magic and shut down this whole ENTIRE website he will
Are you reading this right now? shit he didnt do it
Lets all Pray to Joe Pesci like George Carlin said lol
We get the same results _________________ NEd : Hizz Jizz for a Hamburger ? |
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praxthym New Mark

Joined: 10 Oct 2009 Posts: 51
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Posted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 1:35 am Post subject: |
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| ApolloTe wrote: |
| Mansonmark wrote: |
Imaginary Magic father figure in the sky bless to you as well....  |
Come on Manson mark , why not believe in god?
He Grants all our wishes... |
The arguments leading to these comments may serve to refute divine command theory, but they fall short of refuting one that is identifying god with logic and morality. |
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ApolloTe New Mark

Joined: 01 Jul 2008 Posts: 356 Location: Jacksonville
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Posted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 6:54 am Post subject: |
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| praxthym wrote: |
| ApolloTe wrote: |
| Mansonmark wrote: |
Imaginary Magic father figure in the sky bless to you as well....  |
Come on Manson mark , why not believe in god?
He Grants all our wishes... |
The arguments leading to these comments may serve to refute divine command theory, but they fall short of refuting one that is identifying god with logic and morality. |
Doesn't fall short, because you cant identify, just like I can't identify the reason for your using italic font
fucking with ya _________________ NEd : Hizz Jizz for a Hamburger ? |
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Mansonmark New Mark

Joined: 09 Jul 2008 Posts: 131
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Posted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 8:58 am Post subject: |
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| praxthym wrote: |
| ApolloTe wrote: |
| Mansonmark wrote: |
Imaginary Magic father figure in the sky bless to you as well....  |
Come on Manson mark , why not believe in god?
He Grants all our wishes... |
The arguments leading to these comments may serve to refute divine command theory, but they fall short of refuting one that is identifying god with logic and morality. |
Logic and morality are human concepts and have nothing to do with the structure of the universe. _________________ www.evalbum.com
www.diyelectriccar.com |
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praxthym New Mark

Joined: 10 Oct 2009 Posts: 51
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Posted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 8:14 pm Post subject: |
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| ApolloTe wrote: |
Doesn't fall short, because you cant identify, just like I can't identify the reason for your using italic font
fucking with ya |
I could identify god with a cheeseburger if I wanted to, but this would be a case of mistaken identity. Take the equation 1 + x = 3. We could identify x with 42, 37, or a cheeseburger, but for the equation to make sense we must make a correct identification.
Atheists rely on logic in order to make their arguments, so it seems nonsensical for an atheist to deny the existence of the logical structure of reality.
| Mansonmark wrote: |
| Logic and morality are human concepts and have nothing to do with the structure of the universe. |
I'm unclear as to what you mean by 'human concepts'. I understand the possibilities, but you have omitted the context. I would be interested in how you would clarify it.
You must rely on logic in order to explain the structure of the universe. It is impossible for you to have a thought without logic as your thoughts embody logical principles. They wouldn't count as thoughts if that were not the case. I'm curious, are you denying the existence of the logical structure of reality?
It seems that when you say 'human concept' you are referring to human constructs, as if humans constructed logic as though it wouldn't exist without them. Yet this is entirely unintelligible. It would be impossible for you to tell me how humans created logic without babbling incoherently.
I am indebted to the author of this paper for the content of my responses. |
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ApolloTe New Mark

Joined: 01 Jul 2008 Posts: 356 Location: Jacksonville
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Posted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 8:22 pm Post subject: |
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| praxthym wrote: |
| ApolloTe wrote: |
Doesn't fall short, because you cant identify, just like I can't identify the reason for your using italic font
fucking with ya |
I could identify god with a cheeseburger if I wanted to, but this would be a case of mistaken identity. Take the equation 1 + x = 3. We could identify x with 42, 37, or a cheeseburger, but for the equation to make sense we must make a correct identification.
Atheists rely on logic in order to make their arguments, so it seems nonsensical for an atheist to deny the existence of the logical structure of reality.
| Mansonmark wrote: |
| Logic and morality are human concepts and have nothing to do with the structure of the universe. |
I'm unclear as to what you mean by 'human concepts'. I understand the possibilities, but you have omitted the context. I would be interested in how you would clarify it.
You must rely on logic in order to explain the structure of the universe. It is impossible for you to have a thought without logic as your thoughts embody logical principles. They wouldn't count as thoughts if that were not the case. I'm curious, are you denying the existence of the logical structure of reality?
It seems that when you say 'human concept' you are referring to human constructs, as if humans constructed logic as though it wouldn't exist without them. Yet this is entirely unintelligible. It would be impossible for you to tell me how humans created logic without babbling incoherently.
I am indebted to the author of this paper for the content of my responses. |
God and Cheeseburgers ..... WOW.
I can see a cheeseburger , I can have someone produce it for me , if I asked 10000 times for a cheesburger sooner or later someone will make me one
If I ask 100000 times for god to speak to me directly, i will just grow tired of repeating myself
I like Burgers to
Are you a fat christian ? _________________ NEd : Hizz Jizz for a Hamburger ? |
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Mansonmark New Mark

Joined: 09 Jul 2008 Posts: 131
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Posted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 8:33 pm Post subject: |
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What we, as humans, consider logic, may not apply to the actual structure of the universe. Basically I'm suggesting that humans may not be able to understand the true structure of reality. Similar to the way a dog can see a book, can see words, but will never comprehend what those symbols mean. The universe may or may not have a logical structure that humans can understand.
Regardless, you seemed to have latched on to this very limited definition of god= logical structure. That certainly has no correlation to the myths and "rules" that most believers apply, as they see fit, to their definition of god and religion. "Logical Structure" doesn't require worship, faith, prayer,etc. it simply is. If you want to call that "god", or Tom, Dick, or Harry, doesn't make it so. The term "god" has a basic connotation as something beyond the physical laws of the universe. _________________ www.evalbum.com
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